On this week's Industrial Talk we're onsite at IoT Solutions World Congress and talking to Jonas Daberkow, Director – Equipment-as-a-Service, Relayr about “EaaS and benefits of this solution to your operations”. Learn about EaaS along with Jonas's unique insight into the future of Asset Management on this Industrial Talk interview!
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Company LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/relayr/
Company Website: https://relayr.io/
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Welcome to the industrial talk podcast with Scott Mackenzie. Scott is a passionate industry professional dedicated to transferring cutting edge industry focused innovations and trends while highlighting the men and women who keep the world moving. So put on your hard hat, grab your work boots, and let's go.
Alright, once again, thank you very much for joining industrial taka, thank you very much for your support. We are building a platform that is educating the world and in the wonders of industry. How about that jump?
It's it sounds fantastic.
We are broadcasting definitely from the IoT solutions World Congress here in Barcelona, Spain. This is 2023. And it's great. It's it's getting a little evening ish. And the lights are coming in. We're having a great time. And we've got the Jonas Relayr is the company is in the hot seat. Let's get cracking. Yeah,
that sounds just thanks for having me. scoffs It's a pleasure.
Okay. Where are you from?
So I'm originally from Germany.
All right. Well, how can you have the single Shaxson?
That's a good question. Because
you got me all confused now.
Long story, all I can say is involves a lot of Irish pubs. That's
All right. For the listeners out there. Let's get started. Yeah, pretty good
conference, by the way. Fantastic conference.
You guys go. I have another great booth. Thanks. Oh, it wasn't like last year's. No, it was.
It's a new design. Yes. It's pretty cool. It's shipping containers these days. I saw that. Yeah. So easy. No, it's lovely.
Yes, it's cool. Security background. Give us a little background on who Jonas's
a Super. Thank you. So Jonas Daberkow, I'm the Director of Equipment-as-a-Service of Relayr to Munich Re company. My background, I'm industry engineer, worked a lot of manufacturing, and dedicate my career to digital transformation of manufacturing industry 4.0. And now I have the pleasure to lead the equivalence service product for Relayr. This is, for me, one of my passion projects, I think the seat base. Let's move on.
Yeah, let's let's let's get let's dive in. Because I know, software as a service. I know what that is. So now we're getting into a new coin, E. A S. So talk to us a little bit about what that is?
Absolutely. So equipment as a service is essentially you own the you are using equipment, industrial equipment, and only pay for the output, right? It's a bit like when you today you don't buy a car anymore. You you open the app, and you essentially say, Okay, I'm gonna drive from here to there, and you get charged by kilometers, you actually drive right, then you don't have to worry about the car. It's the same for industrial equipment, you only pay for the output of the equipment, you don't have to worry about anymore. The maintenance, the the residual value and all these things. So you can focus on the core business of adding value.
Okay, so here, here's here, here's a sloppy use case, I'm out there and I'm in, I have a manufacturing facility, I have that pump, there is the pump right over there. You're saying I could go to Relayr and say, Hey, I have pump x, y, z, I want to use your solution and service. I like doing this over there. Can you work on? Can you do that? That pump right there?
Essentially, yeah, that for a sloppy? Let's that's absolutely. So what we do as Relayr, we partner with OEM, so machine manufacturing companies, to help them to provide their machines as a paper demand guarantee performance out of the box solution to the end user. Right? So that means you're
guaranteed performance. Yes, you you nailed that. So that means if I, if I want you to get that pump, and you go with the OEM, and you're doing that, that pump, you're you're doing all the maintenance, you're doing everything to keep that acid, you're, you're, you know, you've applied your digital transformation devices, and you're pulling data off, and then you're reading it, and it's got the vibration and all of that you're doing
absolutely we do the finding of the equipment, right? So you have the variable payment, full flow injection us, right, we do the operations. We use technology to improve the performance and ensure the performance work together with the OEM to improve the uptime of the equipment. But also we take the risk of the rights of guaranteeing performance is all about also taking over the risk. And then we make sure this all works. That's one bundle.
You find that that that sounds so disruptive. It is no it just opens up. And let's put it this way if I'm back to Scott manufacturing process, and I like doing this but I can also just you take care of that. Whatever that is.
It's all about for the for the use of the equipment is focused on what's your what's your value core, it's your core, right, and we take care of the rest. Right. And that's that's the idea. And I think at the moment that this I think this has been Next, the next wave of the one of the next waves of industrial over the next level industrial processes. Because today you have a lot of these kind of maintenance efforts, you have to put, you have to put a lot of management around the assets. And tomorrow, if you want to, let's say you just want a new order, right? You need a CNC machine for next five years to live on that audit, you don't know what happens afterwards, right? So you just need for five years, we call the OEM the partners with us, we provide the asset, link it to the Manage equity half. And it's not a CapEx kind of thing for ya know, it really transforms a CapEx to OPEX kind of expense. So you really pay for what you're using that machine.
So, if I contacted you, when I got manufacturing, right, I contact you and I said, I see this equipment as a service, like, how do you work? Or how do you go into my business to say, that's, that's more in line with? No, yes. Yeah, maybe that how do you how do you assess that? What's that take us through that process.
So essentially, we partner with OEM industrial equipment OEMs. And this is not limited to a very niche, but we, we partner with, with a broad range of industrial equipment, we try being it in, in printing, being in metal processing, being in, in food being you know, there's a broad range. And it's this model a place now to most of the industries to be honest, right, of course, and we're not talking about if you have $100 equipment might not be the right move, right. But as soon as you have an equipment that is above 12k, it becomes really interesting for you, maybe not to take up a loan or to to have some leasing over 10 years, but really just to, to acquire an equipment on a pay per use basis.
See, I would say in the in the world of the CNC would be a great sort of marketing, in a sense, because we were at a we were at an event, and some of these machines use CNC machines. There's their size of rooms, they're They're massive. And I always I've always wondered, man, how would you paper that up? And how would you ensure that I'm getting value and maintaining it? Those are complex systems? Absolutely. And I mean, that's disruptive, just telling you right now. And you don't limit you don't limit yourself to any I mean, any industry is,
of course, it has to make sense, right? So Right? Not every, let's say not every machine is necessarily a people use case. So for example, if you buy a machine, and you know, for the next 1020 years, it just will run like clockwork into this, like, you will always have a fully utilized and, you know, look the best case, but as soon as, okay, as soon as you have variation in demand. And if you look at supply chain disruptions today, in the changes of the of our, of our manufacturing world, as you see at the moment, this isn't very attractive, though. Oh, many machines.
Now I get it. Now I've seen it. Because now if I have a fully utilized asset that's spinning at 100% utilization, and it's in and for the next 10 to 20, yeah, you're good to go, You're fine, you're fine. Is that very ability that for me from a business perspective, I would have a hard time. One justifying the acquisition or purchase of that, just because I don't see a stability in the utilization, that acid. And that's where you can you can, you can minimize
absolute, that's also it's all about, you know, moving to one output right there. I mean, there are processes, for example, like cooling processes where you want to run continuously, right, but you always want to have a certain output of the cooling process. That's another great example. You say, Okay, if I just want to purchase the cooling 10 To cool temperature within my cabinet, I don't want to care about the rest of it. So it's always a you also use case
for it. Now, all of a sudden, you have taken me down a different journey. You're you're saying from a cooling point. See,
we good? We good?
I think we are okay. See, see Jonas has violated the very important table down here is very important. However, I can purchase the cooling the chiller unit in
the output, stop putting the op and not the machines, and what do you need to make it happen? Right, it's all of it's also about aligning, you know, getting the incentives aligned. We all want the same thing. Want the best output of the machine now?
Has been doing this.
For the last three years, three, four years still relay us 10 years old now.
Yeah, but you're still coming up with other options, other ways of looking at. So you as the experts. You're just looking at all businesses, and you're saying hey, our model is this we can fly there. And for me as a business, I Do I Do I Do I minimize that volatility, that uncertainty if I work with, in concert with you guys. Absolutely fancy. Now where were you when I was running all this stuff? The less headaches? And Nevermind, it's that simple. What do you mean? Where do you see it going? What what? What's that sort of next, you know, horizon? Because just like everything else down here at IoT solutions World Congress, it's like, Hey, we got a new version. Here's a new use case here. Yeah. And it's just keeps on blistering.
I think to be very honest, I mean, what we see already with the criminals, it's the move towards, you know, not thinking of tech use cases here and tech use case here. It's about aligning us behind the output we want actually to achieve right. And now we're looking at we see the case or in the past, today, on equipment. Yeah, I believe the next move will be the the production line, the value chain, like the plan that Jeff talked about. And it's all about variability of that production flow, or that the value creation to do that, and at the murderer thinks it's talking about the criminal service is the equipment, but will once you have to first equipment, why don't have the second equipment as well as a service. So you can actually have the full variability of before exam production line to actually demands.
See, I don't
think it's cool.
Maybe I'm just sort of geeky and wonky that way. But I think it's cool. Now. And
I think, you know, we came quite a long way. I thought the last three years, or multiple years, we established no ecosystem of it's a little fine structures, risk structures, IoT to make it happen. It's ready to go. We can make
there's the pitch. How do they get a hold again? How this is, this is great stuff. In the States.
We are here we are global, right? We're here. At the stage, you can call in can write an email, and you're not stopped albacore related to our homepage. Really, I don't I Oh, come to the booth. Or the or the president. Hey,
you didn't disappoint. I was concerned when they said, Hey, he's gonna be talking about this. I said, Oh, man, I don't know what happened. But you didn't disappoint. That's a fact. Jack. Very great. Thanks
so much. All right, listeners.
You need to reach out to Jonas. Because he got he likes country music, too. And he's got this British German Melvina he's cool. He's cooler than me. Let's put it that way. All right. Well, IoT solutions World Congress 2023 You're gonna get people like Jonathan, you got to put this on your calendar. It is a must attend event. Big time. Thank you very much. We're gonna wrap it up on the other side. So stay tuned. Thanks so much.
You're listening to the industrial talk, Podcast Network.
All right. Once again, thank you very much for joining industrial talk and absolutely wonderful that you support this platform that celebrates industry professionals, all around the world. Please subscribe, be a part of the community get the latest and greatest because we're all about educating, collaborating, and of course, innovating. And speaking of that Yiannis, and of course, you've been hearing me talk about Jonas, it's Jonas make that correction, because I lack the ability to be able to say names properly, but that Giannis right there reach out, you will not be disappointed. And I gotta tell you that equipment as a service is brilliant, is brilliant. And, and if you're, you're into the, the need to keep that asset up and running, and you want to focus on your core business. This is such a great solution that addresses a challenge that definitely will make you a success. Right there. Relayr reach out, be honest. All right. Again, we're building this platform, this platform is truly celebrates you, as an industry professional, you as a company, because the reality is, is that we need you, the world needs you. You are solving problems, you are addressing those problems, you are collaborating, you are doing everything to make our lives better. That's why you deserve the success. You deserve the amplification, reach out to me go out to industrial talk and you're saying yourself, Scott, how do I get involved? Do that reach out to me? And let's have a conversation. Because I really am I'm just a cheerleader that just enjoys industry. All right. Be bold, be brave, dare greatly be honest. Hang out with people like him and you're going to change the world. We're gonna have another great conversation coming from IoT solutions World Congress 23 shortly so stay tuned